This is the only pic we have of Mr. S. I blurred it a bit to protect his identity. He's done a great job for over 2 months now - and he's THRILLED with the pay rate.
You’ve heard me rave about hiring workers from other countries to help work in different aspects of my online businesses. Below is a step by step story of one recent worker I found on odesk.com. I take a unique approach to finding and hiring the RIGHT PERSON the FIRST TIME. This list will help you do the same thing.
I recently found and hired a fantastic worker in India (I’ll call him Mr S.) for just over $3 per hour. He’s THRILLED to have the work and he keeps us profitable on inventory that might otherwise be unsellable (thin profit margins). He handles many of our listings on eBay. It took me less than an hour of total work, and under a 24 hours start to finish to find and hire him. A day later he was working.
Here’s how it worked:
1. I signed up with odesk.com. They allow you to post jobs for free.
2. To determine what sort of “talent” was available to meet our needs, I performed a “search contracts” search for the keywords “ebay listing” to see what sort of workers were out there. I found hundreds.
3. I read over the “bio’s” of a handful of the “contractors” that came up. (“Contractors” is what Odesk calls their outsource workers) I could have easily hired one of these worker on the spot, but I didn’t (you’ll cause yourself a big headache if you do that). I suggest you go a couple steps further to find the RIGHT worker the first time. The purpose of reviewing this list was to give me an idea of what keywords and descriptions to use when putting together a job description for my own worker.
4. I set up a brief job description using the “post a job” feature. I pulled some keywords from the “bio’s” of the contractors that I’d just seen.
5. IMPORTANT: As part of the job description I included a link to a simple “Jing“* video for each candidate to watch. I made the video in under one minute and it instructed the candidates to provide me a link to a recent eBay auction that they had built and launched (since that would be their job). I also asked them to briefly explain in their own words how they felt about this project, and what their eBay experience was. This does several things for me. It confirms that the candidate has a good internet connection (they can see vide0), it confirms that they understand my spoken English instructions, it gets them to send a unique response back to me instead of just a copy/paste response that could have been written by anyone etc. If I had so desired I could have also requested that they send me back a jing* video response to make communication that much easier (but I didn’t in this case).
6. I received over 60 responses within 12 hours. 80% of them did not follow my instructions to include a link to a recent eBay auction that they had launched. That same 80% was instantly eliminated from my list of potential candidates (Odesk makes it easy to keep track of which candidates are still in the running.)
7. Of the handful of applicants that did make the cut, only about 6-8 of them had good English writing skills. Of those, three were asking for a very competitive pay rate and also had fantastic feedback from other employers (Odesk uses a feedback system much like eBay to rate workers). The decision was easy from there.
8. Bottom line: Hire the most experienced, most qualified and least expensive worker you can find. Narrow down your list by requesting a simple task be performed in their application response.
*Jing is a free and VERY simple “screen capture” video recording tool. I require all my workers to learn to use it because it’s a fantastic way to “show and tell” instructions without a lot of typing. Get it here: techsmith.com/jing.html Watch the demo video here.
For more advanced training on hiring workers from other countries, as well as access to pre-screened and highly qualified workers, please check out the resources offered by John Jonas. He’s my “go to” expert on all things related to outsourcing. Here’s a link to his site: LocalBusinessOutsourcingHelp.com
Interesting article Jim.
Maybe next time you can hire an American worker instead of out-sourcing the job. Every job helps you know.
I hire many American workers for my biz, but none of them would have jobs if I stop being profitable.
How do you handle security issues? giving acess to ebay? Or your web site?
Jim adressed the password thing above. You could start a new ebay account just for this employees work. Just put a note that this account is new and you have lots of good feedback on your main account.
I would think it would be easy to make a dropbox account just for ebay. Get the employee to make a free dropbox account as well.
Then in your dropbox name a folder by that employees name. Lets call him “mr x” . Then you share that folder between you and “mr.x” using his email
In the mr x folder you have a ebay labeled folder with all the pictures and any notes. Label that folder the inbox. He can download the info that way. You can also have a text file in there for notes etc.
If you need another worker just add and share a folder just like above. It would be easy to unshare a folder if “mr x” is ever “fired”.
Note to Jim-I really like this blog and am going to read much more. Thanks jim for the smart ideas. 🙂
I did some research on the whole “giving out your password problem.” Here is a solution. Ebay has several all in one clients for placing auctions . I read a few of the descriptions and this one has a option for additional users where you set permissions on access to your ebay account. Here is the user manual go to “advanced topics” then managing multiple users”.
http://www.blackthornesw.com/robo/projects/blackthornepro/
(looks like the pro version is 25$ a month, but it takes “trust” out of the employee picture to some degree. Might be worth it to some:
Here is part of the description:
With Blackthorne Pro, you can create multiple user logins. Each
person in your organization can have their own login id and password to
access eB. Logins are managed by an administrator. The administrator
can customize the data and features that a user has access to as well as
what user interface customizations they can make. This will allow
different users to see the features and data that they need to perform
their job, but nothing else.
example: Endless Mountains Enterprises is a small
business that sells items on eBay. The owner, Rob, has two employees,
Brendan and Emily. Brendan, lists all of the items, and Emily performs
all the after sale processing. To keep his customer data confidential,
he has set up a user account for each employee and turned off the
ability to see reports and buyers credit card info for those accounts.
Also, since Brendan only lists the items, he is not allowed to see the Finalize Sales
tab, send email or leave feedback. Since Emily only handles the
shipping, she is not allowed to submit items or edit pictures. By
creating user accounts, each employee has a user interface tailored to
their job, and can’t accidentally harm or view sensitive data.
There may be more than this. You can see the different ones available on this page. http://pages.ebay.com/sellerinformation/sellingresources/sellingtools.html under all in one solutions. There are a lot of new software partners with ebay and it is worth you time ot check them out.
Does anyone have any experience with this or other all in one solutions?
great find! Thanks for posting!
thanks 🙂
oh that one company lets you try them out for a little bit free.Just download the software and pick the “pro” option. If you use them they are 25 a month I think. There are other programs there so take a look.
Wow! Thanks! That seems to address a lot of peoples’ concerns over the “giving up security of your ebay account”. Very useful.
With no disrespect, from the description it sounded like the Americans could have replied to the odesk job opportunity that Jim posted. I don’t think he chose by location, he chose by price & skill. Maybe the Americans should be buying Jim’s ebook, (Silent Sales Machine), to start their own online business. Ultimately, if people are happy with a $3 an hour job, and their local economy makes that wage workable for them, then no American should feel anything but happy for Jim’s successful (U.S. based) business, which is optimizing it’s labor force, and happy for a (seemingly nice) guy in a developing country that now has a good job.
Am I wrong?
Have you ever used Amazon Mechanical Turk for graphic design work, and if so, how did it go? I’m setting up a Zazzle store and I need a good graphic designer for wedding invitation designs. I tried Fiverr, but the designs I received were horrible quality, tacky, and even incorporated trademarked characters from Disney and Precious Moments. They were beyond awful.
For graphic design work that is NOT corporate logos or corporate-looking banner ads and web design, how do you screen a good candidate? I need someone with good artistic sensibility and also good *taste* to design *tasteful*, sophisticated and elegant wedding invitations. Help!
Vicki – I’m a fan of 99designs.com as well for graphic design. Haven’t use mechancial turk, but have heard good things.
I also support 99designs. That’s how I found my designer. After our initial transaction on 99designs we moved to oDesk and now any other work I need him to do to completed through oDesk. He isn’t the cheapest, he is $30phr on oDesk. But is really fast and produces high quality work.
Jim
I too have hired on odes but have hesitated with eBay related. How do they list your products? Don’t you have to do the listings to show them? Also, do they actually manage your ebay listings too??
Thanks
we “manage” the eBay process, but they do the “dirty” work. We provide pics, and they step through the process of listing the products/descriptions. Each seller will have a different experience I’m sure, but anything repetitive can be taught to an outsource worker (if logistically possible).
I need someone for an accounting job… this will be great if it works. Thanks.
plenty of talent in that field on odesk. NEVER NEVER NEVER do data entry yourself or pay anyone more than a few dollars per hour to do it.
Classic American Comment from Uncle Sam
You use chinese imports and hire foreign workers when times are good. But when u americans(maybe all humans are like this?) are kicked in the teeth economically you switch gears and throw efficiency and good management out the window.
This is classic colonialist thinking.
Thank you for sharing. These are great ideas. I’ve hired workers on elance in the past and while I’ve found some great workers, I’ve also had a few headaches that this process would have saved.
It’s great to get it right the first time. For even better hiring skills, and pools of qualified workers, check out the stuff from John Jonas (link above). He’s fantastic.
Jim, Why did you choose Odesk over Onlinejobs.ph, since you considere John Jonas your go to guy?
Great question! The number of “eBay ready” skilled workers on Odesk made it my go to choice for that particular hire.
Hi Jim, good article…
Wow, just Wow! This is very helpful! Thank you.
Great post Jim. I’ve asked prospects to answer some questions for me…some questions directly related to the job (like “How many WordPress blogs have you transfered to new hosting accounts?”) and other ones just to see how good they are at jumping through hoops (like “Who is the mother of Brad Pitt’s children?”). It shows me how good they are at following directions and how eager they are to work. But I do LOVE the Jing video idea. Never thought about the good internet and English test. Will definitely be trying that out for the next job I post on Odesk!
I also support 99designs. That’s how I found my designer. After our initial transaction on 99designs we moved to oDesk and now any other work I need him to do to completed through oDesk. He isn’t the cheapest, he is $30phr on oDesk. But is really fast and produces high quality work.
Thanks Jim for the article. I’ve used oDesk a number of times. But I really liked your approach to the hiring process. I’m going to try that next time.
My concern would be to give my password to a stranger. Can you give us your take on this? Thanks
see the other response to this same question.
Info: Sooner or later there has to be a thing called trust. We’ve now been working with the one developer for the last 9 months and he has access to everything these days. Just back up everything early in the piece and build a relationship.
Great posts here!
I’ve been using Odesk for a couple of years now, on and off, usually for one-off tasks.
I’ve had a couple of ‘flakes’ but for the most part, the workers there are great. I concur with Jim’s idea of doing the video approach, and it is one I employ as well.
One further bit of advice that might sound really silly but works as a great “eliminator” of applicants who don’t read the full job description or follow instructions well is to bury a line of instruction in the job description telling the applicant to include some key identifying word or phrase in the subject line of their application. (E.g. “Pineapple cake makes me feel giddy” or “Parrots riding pogosticks” – kind of silly but really stand out…) That way you simply have to glance at the subject lines of their application to know to click the ‘delete’ button, as it were.
Fantastic advice. I’ll be using that idea.
We just hire our pre-teen boys. They are motivated to earn money and happy to take pictures and clean up as needed. Our kids are learning with us on what has good potential to sell on ebay. We think and hope that we are setting a good example for them to work hard, work smart (very important) and to, hopefully, have and independent and entrepreneurial spirit. They really help us to be productive and it’s great to know that they just might get a head start on harnessing the power of the internet.
Just want to add a big Thank YOU to Jim and all his team for giving us the ideas, inspiration, motivation, as you lift us all to positive, greater possibilities to achieve our goals!
Would rather find a way to keep AMERICANS employed, Jim.
I don’t help people find jobs. I help them find independence.
This whole site is written and given freely to help people, including AMERICANS, to find their own wealth. The ones that can get off their fat lazy butts that is. Your comment was completely irrational. What are YOU doing to “find a way to keep AMERICANS employed”?
@1d730d5aa1fdb710a6db0d61ea1ff7ff:disqus because I outsource I’m keeping Americans employed. Because I outsource I’m not mooching off the state living on welfare taxing our already over taxed govt. And because I outsource for over 3.5 years now, I’ve got other Americans earning money that they wouldn’t before. Educate yourself bro, before you post.
I too wonder about the password situation with Ebay. I see several people have asked that, without a response. Can you elaborate on the best way to handle that and keep your account secure?
Thanks for the great job that you do, Jim!
You must give the password to your worker. It’s that simple. For the first few days you monitor the situation closely, but ask yourself this question: “Why would someone looking for work take the opportunity to sabbotage my eBay account in some way once I give them my password?”
I’ve NEVER heard of a worker doing any intentional damage to an eBay account just because they could.
If you come to the point of “firing” a worker and you are worried they’ll be upset and do something stupid at that point, simply change the password before informing them that you no longer need their services.
To me, this is a non-issue. There’s no damage that can be done that isn’t easily undone and then prevented, and the odds of it coming to that are so low that’s it’s hardly worth being concerned over.
I posted a simple job on odesk and got lots of replies. Some of these were from American contractors too, so they can just as easily throw their hat into the ring like the rest of them. Also, for many of the applicants, they are coming in low just to get their foot in the door, which is fine. I’ll do the same thing at times when providing services to my prospects.
My problem on Odesk as an applicant is that, it’s got some pretty competitive candidates.
Sometimes they even go down to their level just so they can land a job. I think having a good reputation on odesk (which is
also equally important as having a kickass resume and cover letter), an applicant shouldn’t sell himself short and at the
same time not over charge. You should hire someone with an hourly rate they deserve
based on their special skills and experience.
Like Staff.com, an online job site I highly recommend, I think it’s pretty interesting because candidates are hired there, not because of the rate but because of his talent and skills. I think it’s just fair.
Great post and thanks for sharing! I was wondering outside of shipping, does Mr. S do ALL the eBay work (from listing, answering inquiries, etc)? Does Mr. S access your eBay account from India or did he create an entirely new account when you started hiring him? Appreciate you sharing this with everyone!
Good questions – happy to help.
We tend to monitor incoming questions (someone on my local staff does that) b/c often it involves taking a look at the physical inventory to answer the question.
Mr. S DOES access our account from India. He uses my same ID/PW. If you work with someone reputable there’s virtually no risk in this model. You can easily change your ID/PW if things start to not work out.
Hi Jim,
I have done exactly the same once with an employee from India, but then got a bit “scared” that the employee will change the username/password by himself, bak account, secret questions, etc.
How you avoid this risk? he can eventually take FULL control on your account…
Only work with reputable workers and know that ebay would cooperate in assisting you if someone tried to steal your account. For the record I’ve never heard of this happening with an outsourced worker.
@pissed if you can afford to pay $50/hr do it!
Please define “afford”. If you mean wiping out my checking account by giving everyone who works for me a 500% rate increase…then yes, I can afford it temporarily…until I go out of business and then I can’t afford it any longer and we all stop getting paid. Another question: If someone offers to do a job at a rate of pay that is fair to them should I turn them down and pick someone who charges more? Would you like to approve each of my hires so that they are sure to get paid enough and I don’t make you angry? Should I give my other workers pay cuts so that I can pay those you are angry about more? Serious questions if you are actually “pissed” as you say.
Love the idea, Jim. I have done eBay in the past, but less than 6 months ago started my FBA business. (I bought your PAC and find it fantastic, by the way.) After getting used to the ease of FBA, the thought of doing eBay listings seems like so much work!
I am a little unsure of what all needs to be said in the video that I create. To make sure that I’m not leaving out any instructions, I would love to view the actual video that you sent to Mr. S.
Is that a possibility?
Thanks in advance!
I recently hired a worker from Odesk, after reading your blog. She has been using my pw and login for ebay for a couple of days,and Ebay has just asked her for her computers identity. Have you had this issue before?
Yep! We’ve had this issue initially and we just passed the security info to our worker so they could log on. It also helps to let eBay know that you have a worker in a foreign country accessing your account – they’ll turn off the extra security at log in.
I’ve never had an outsource employee tamper with an account, nor have I heard a story of that happening. There’s nothing for them to gain from it, and they’d only destroy their reputation. Hire someone with a good reputation and the risk is virtually non-existent.
Has anyone had any luck with interns instead of outsourcing? I was always intrigued by the prospect of hiring some interns.
I just arrived at this post from chapter 3.3 of the audio from “Silent Sales Machine.” I hear your quote often ‘People with skills work with people with ideas.” It’s something I will be doing much more of in 2014. Thank you!
How do you “know” they are working the hours they state?
Do you have a minimum of listings/hour requirement?
great question – you can easily track it though. If the work isn’t getting done, or isn’t getting done right you take corrective action. You have them document their tasks and time stamp their progress until you get a baseline of what’s expected. From there, you always can tell how they are doing.
Like and exploring your idea, Jim.. Before employ worker help listing, should we learn how to bulk list in eBay first before outsourcing? Or we just let the worker do all for us?
it’s hard to train someone on a process you don’t understand yourself. That being said, you can likely find someone familiar with the bulk listing tool you plan to use, and then no training will be necessary!
One of my fiends outsourced work to Indians and got rid of them soon as the integrity issues. It is not a good idea to outsource for India. This is the story of lots of people who went on this path
Jim, it’s been a couple of years since your post (based on the comments’ ages). Are you still using Mr. S? Still happy with the folks you get from odesk.com?
Very happy. Still using them!
Great information Jim, just started following you recently and you are most informative.
Two great pieces of advice Jim!
“People with skills work with people with ideas”
“I don’t help people find jobs. I help them find independence”
Thank you Jim..
Hey Jim,
I’ve got a quick question. I’m looking to outsource but how did your virtual assistant list on your eBay account being that he’s from a different location and eBay has security to monitor where your account is being logged into from.
I ask because I’ve been out of town and still in the United States and eBay has said that they temporarily blocked my account because I was in a new location and I had to verify my account in order to log back in.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
You can let eBay’s security team know that an out of country IP address will be accessing your account and they’ll flag it as a legit access point. That’s what we did.
I know this is an old discussion, but here is to hoping it is still monitored. We sell quite a few one off items. I can’t seem to figure out the logistics in having an outsourced individual to create the listings. If we have to give them all the details and photos, would it not be just as quick to create the listings from a template? Ideas would be appreciated.
Everyone has different processes in place, but if you have any repetitive processes in place, those should be jobs that are done by others. It might require a bit of testing to determine what strategy is best for you. Always be improving your processes.
I remember hearing something about a 13 month, do you know anything about it
Yes there is such a thing! It’s traditional in the Philippines to pay a full months salary once per year to workers. It’s almost expected culturally. Research it on Google -plenty of content there to educate you on the tradition.
Jim, thanks so much for your article. How can I have someone check prices for me throughout the day? I recently started drop shipping & keeping track of price changes is very time consuming. My main supplier is Amazon. Is it risky to give access to my eBay account to an oDesk worker so he or she could go into my account & change prices for me throughout the day? Is there anything an oDesk worker could do without me knowing once he or she is in my eBay account? That’s really my only concern at this time. If I could get past that, I’ll really be able to put up more listings instead of constantly monitoring prices on the one’s I currently have up. Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Candie
Hire a reputable VA with a track record of good feedback from several other employers – and give them your necessary passwords. They have no economic benefit in “burning” you and destroying their reputation. In 13 years of teaching people to use VA’s I’ve NEVER heard of a VA doing damage to someones account (any account) b/c they had the PW. A good worker will treat the responsibility with care. Even if they do burn you, a quick phone call to the service in question, or a quick reset of your PW is all it will take. It comes down to trust. Hire someone you can trust and turn them loose!
Hope this is still active because I have an important question: Ebay does not allow you to run multiple ebay accounts under different identities. They track you through IP address, cookies on your computer, browser fingerprinting, etc. If this contractor is doing work for you and 10 other ebay users from the same IP address and computer, what is to stop ebay from recognizing it as the same person running multiple accounts, and shut everyone down?
If you give your worker admin access and alert eBay that you are doing so, there’s no issue. We’ve had numerous workers get into our account while also doing work on their own or other accounts without issue. To be cautious you can alert ebay to the arrangement possibly I suppose.
Hi Jim!
Awesome article!! Im looking to hire a VA to do my dropship ebay listings. Question: do you also have your VA fullfill the orders on amazon and other sources? That would mean giving them access to your credit card , im a little nervous about that.
You can trust your VA slowly at first and then let it build. Trust = consistency + time
Giving them your passwords and credit card is actually low risk activities once they’ve earned your trust. They can’t “steal” your business, and any fraud would be easily and instantly reported and corrected (but if you proceed with wisdom it will never happen).
Business systems are built on trust and relationships. Doing it all yourself is a weak option.
Thanks Jim!
of course! 🙂
if you hire someone with an established reputation from another country there is no reason to worry about this detail. They can’t possibly switch ownership if they wanted to, and their entire reputation that they’ve worked so hard to establish would be destroyed…for no gain on their part!
What’s in it for them to mess up your eBay account?
I’ve always given established contract workers full access to accounts that they’ve needed without a single issue – nor have I heard any horror stories from others who work with fully established, reputable outsource workers from places like upwork.com. PAY ATTENTION TO THEIR REPUTATION SCORE!
Thanks!
Jim, how many listings does he do in an hour. I could not find an answer in the comments and I know this is an old post. I am so tired of listing though. I mean I know you can’t tell me the exact numbers, but on average. Do you have them use turbo lister and schedule it so you can review first or what.
@pissed. These people make 200 bucks full time a month in there country, we give them a job where they make much more than that. Americans are greedy. I am a disabled Vet who fought for this country and the freedom we have destroyed, I use VA’s for everything, just because I can afford them and not the ones that want a million dollar house.
we aren’t using a VA for eBay listing as much as we used to, but it really did vary when we were using them. Over time, they got faster – and we’d pay more! Finding a hiring good help is the trick- once you have a great worker take good care of them!
I’m so sorry for asking a “stupid question”, but what does “VA” means? I can’t find the definition of this word in Google. I’m a newbie by the way. It is so hard to sell things on eBay. My account has nearly 20 items and nothing sold yet.
Virtual assistant. An online worker you’ve never actually met who you pay to assist with various tasks in your business.
What I don’t understand is if these Indian workers or anyone for that matter can do all the things neccessary for this business, than why don’t they just do it themselves? Why make only 3.50 an hr when you can have the whole business with your own skills? It’s like asking a successful business person to work for me instead of having their own business?
Also what do you need in order to have them start on your business? Can you be a beginner and have these workers start the whole thing for you?
Thanks.
Not everyone is entrepreneurial. In some cultures it’s actually a very negative thing oddly enough, however having a “job” is a good thing in all cultures.
Running a business takes focused leadership. No, you can’t just hire someone and say, “make me money here the guide”. It doesn’t work that way.
there are many problems in some countries for example in Pakistan, no paypal available, no ebay or amazon working in my country. But, we worked with many international sellers so we have experience of ebay and amazon. But we can’t do business in pakistan due to absence of paypal and top online selling site. So, we have only option to provide services instead of selling own.
Ok, Jim, like someone else said, I know this is an older post BUT…first let me say I just purchased the PAC today and am blown away at how much content you provide!! Just, WOW! I am very stoked about starting my business and am equally excited about being in a position to receive coaching from your fine staff.
So…this topic REALLY excites me because my girlfriend, who I want to bring to the States, is in Italy. Would you recommend having a significant other as an international VA or is it best to follow the time-honored advice of keeping friends/family and business seperate? I trust her 100%, very honest girl AND she could use the income. Thank you Jim and I look forward to being a part of your team!
As a guy who has been married for a couple decades plus I can advise you that asking her what SHE wants to do here is the right answer…and when/if she changes her mind go with it.
Working together as partners is a great thing…but it’s not necessary, and it’s certainly not something to push on her if she’s not interested.
Thanks for the feedback!
Thanks for the reply, Jim! Jobs in Italy are VERY difficult to come by, that and she was diagnosed with MS last year and I think her being able to work from and source Italian products for me would be a perfect fit for her right now. Thanks again!
Sounds awesome to me too! Make it happen my friend! I’m sure there are many great Italian products you could test out on the US market in small quantities until you land on a winner!
Grazie millie, mio amico! I, WE will let you know how it works!
I look forward to it! 🙂
I give them full access to my account!
Oops
I trust them and give them full access. They can’t steal anything from me by being able to log in to my eBay account. It does require trust. I’ve never been burned, nor have I heard of anyone being burned by ID theft when working with a good reputation outsource worker.
Check their reputation!
don’t drop ship.
Here’s why: https://www.jimcockrum.com/blog/2016/05/03/drop-shipping-as-a-seller-dont-do-it-unless/
Hi Jim! I have reviewed the discussion and it’s awesome. Everything that you said is true about hiring a VA, especially when they are just starting to grow on eBay. Most of the happy and satisfied costumers leave good feedback when there is an updated tracking information and an immediatele reply from their questions about the items posted. When you have positive feedbacks, buyers will surely recommend your online store to their friends. I think this is really cool and is perfect for me. I want to be a VA too, especially on eBay. How can I find an employer?
apply at freeeup.com or upwork.com and share your skill set there!